16 years ago
Mon Jan 28 2008, 05:36pm
Blindmouse - I thought Kella might be in love with Darius too. If so, I think the feeling is mutual. I can't remember the exact quote, but there was some reference to him being brokenhearted and preoccupied about something as well. I figured it was either to do with one of the Twentyfamilies' markers being lost, or that.
Also, about the sword...I thought it might be something to do with the gypsies' ancient promises. I remember one of Elspeth's dreams in Ashling showing Swallow saluting her with a sword; of course, there's nothing to indicate this is the same one but it does make me wonder if Cassy crafted it for one of her descendants. Aside from that, though, I've got nothing. I wish Elf got to keep it, though. ^_^
Something I didn't get to mention before...I was so surprised to find Elspeth travelling with the Kasanda blood (whoever that is) to get the fifth sign from Sador in this book...I always imagined that as being right at the climax of her quest, for some reason. I also loved the fact that Cassy was able to leave her a proper message...I've always hoped they'd be able to meet or talk somehow, whether on the dreamtrails or through the signs, because of the parallels in their lives and the fact that each has spent years dreaming about the other. I was grinning like a loon the whole time I read the message for Elspeth.
Although it's going to drive me mad wondering what that "important thing to remember" at the end was. :P
Btw - I hope Kevrik comes back into it, even if he does seem to have played his part. I loved him! :D
One thing that annoyed me
was that every time Elspeth got into a tricky spot, she would use her Talent and find the mind of someone who was prepared to help her. A Herder novice who hated the Herders, the Shadows, the people in Half-Moon Bay who hated that their town was based on drugs. It just seemed unrealistic that everywhere she went there'd be enough dissatisfaction that complete strangers would drop everything and put themselves in considerable danger to help her. Once would be believable, but every time?
Also did anyone else find it chilling when they put the demon band on Elspeth and she couldn't use her Talents? When I read it I felt like I was being suffocated, the horror was conveyed so well.
Mystic Guilden
16 years ago
Tue Jan 29 2008, 08:00pm
Mystic Guilden
Mage
I completely agree dolorosa!
When Elf had the demon band forced on her i felt suffocated too. Actually, for a moment I thought "oh, now i'm stuck in my own head" LOL...i felt mind bound!. Kudos to IC for making that seem so real!
I liked Kevrik's character too, he kind of reminded me of Gilbert waaay back in the farssekers. I must admit i hated Gilbert when he first came back into the story, and even when Elf did sort him out...he wasnt the old Gilbert that I liked.
With the maps
I assumed that Elf would be making the treck into the blacklands and would eventually find land that was not tainted. When I read the part abou the Maps, i was sure thats what would happen. But i guess we wont know for sure until we read The Sending
16 years ago
Wed Jan 30 2008, 09:52am
La la la filler space for the side menu!
RE Salamander
As soon as Elspeth mentioned the yellow eyes, I kind of choked in shock, and immediately SMSed Min like "OMFG NO WAI!" haha. But how certain was Daffyd that Salamander is a Sadorian?
I know I haven't posted in this thread before, despite having finished the book a few days before Min started it, but I'll try to keep up now ;)
And I want to say that I think this is the best book so far. It was chock-a-block full of action and adventure, and when there wasn't any action, Elspeth was finding out lots of info on her quest, the Beforetime, etc.
The entire thing book was just so fresh. I was worried that after 9 years, we would have guessed it all, and it would be just like Harry Potter - when something exciting happened, I would just be like "meh... saw that coming". BUT NO! Isobelle did an amazing job of keeping me on my toes: she did things I never, ever would have guessed. At the same time, it still felt like the same old Obernewtyn. An absolutely top job... well done Isobelle, and thankyou!
[Edit] Oh, one of the most exciting parts of the book for me was that I was right about the house where Cassy's son was born! XD That particular theory was near and dear to my heart and I when I reached that part of the book, I had goosebumps all over my body and was biting my knuckles because I just couldn't wait to find out what would happen next. Aaah! Amazing! And you know? Even though I had guessed it, there were still things I hadn't guessed, and so it was still unknown, new and exciting. *goosebumps just remembering it!*
I completely agree with your resopnse to all the twists and action, Wayla. I was concerned this would be another HP7 also, but it was really surprising and clever and managed to keep to the spirit of the other books.
When I read that Salamander had yellow eyes I went "Waaait a second", too. It would explain why Alexi's name came up again for about the first time in 4 books. I mean, the only other person who had yellow eyes (that were mentioned, at least) was Marisa, right? And I'm pretty certain she's actually dead. :P
I'm leaning more towards Jakoby's sister, though. Alexi-as-Salamander would be interesting, but I'm positive he's really dead (as I recall, Rushton and the others killed him before he could escape the Zebkhran cave, so I'm sure there was actually a body there) and I think the pieces fit more with Seresh. Why else would IC have included her story? And Salamander's voice was "deep-toned and smooth...despite being slightly muffled by the cloth over his face" (pg 271). A woman's voice could be deep too, especially if she disguised it slightly to keep anyone from realising she was female.
After all the theorising that's been done over who Salamander might be, it would be funny if he/she turned out to be a character not even introduced until the end of the 5th book.
Mystic Ward
16 years ago
Mystic Ward
Twentyfamilies Gypsy
on that:
Alexi's eyes are described as being yellow in one passage and dark in another. I will look up the page references when I have time.
OMG Just finished OMG EEEEEE
Eeeee! So much happened!
I thought that Saresh-is-Salamander thing too, especially when Jakoby mentioned her love of clothes. But I don't know...
DOMICK! I was never really all that fond of him, but dying like that! And without Kella! Argh! *sobs*
The first thing I thought with Elspeth's last dream was "Min was right!" I think I now believe that Matty is the Destroyer :(
LOL at Elspeth wearing jeans and having trouble with bathrooms :P
Argh must go away and process all this new information...
16 years ago
Wed Jan 30 2008, 11:22pm
I too have finished the book!
I'll post up everything I'm curious about at a later date when I've got my thoughts composed together and when its not so late either
First thing I want to mention is Dragon, for some reason when I read the first chapter when it was posted some time ago she became the character I was most interested. And then to find out later that she had disappeared in the middle of the book, and the lack of detail regarding it I guess irked me, not in a sense I was disappointed but it keeps gnawing at me what the hell happened? Did Ariel find her with his freaky furturetelling abilities or what? And then when the stone sword was given to Elspeth and how the overguardian said "its the key to everything" for some reason my thoughts leapt to Dragon, will it help her remember? This probably looks like incomprehensive gabble that is not at substantial backed up
Domick's ordeal and death as I mention prior has left me terrible anguished. I HATE YOU ARIEL YOU SADISTIC SON OF A B****
Other stuff I am most delighted the Elf and Rushie love, and I too have a strong suspicion that Matthew is the destroyer no matter how it breaks my heart :'(
Ashling Guildmistress
16 years ago
Thu Jan 31 2008, 08:58pm
Ashling Guildmistress
Mage
I have finally finished *cheers*
And I've read most of your comments and agree with a lot of them completely including:
Domick - I was so hopeful of him being okay so much so that when I read he was getting buried I had to do a double take and reread that he had actually died ~:|
Matty = Destroyer. No question about it. Also, in the Glossary of Characters at the back, Ariel is not listed as The Destroyer.
Salamander=Selesh. Yep - at first, if he was a male, I was thinking perhaps a bondmate but no - I've since been convinced she's one and the same person. The thing that strikes me though is how did she become so cruel? Did her "rejection" and outcasting from her family really leave her that vengeful?
Ariel x Erin - or anyone else for that matter I think is not possible. Ariel is too self absorbed to have any real relationship, that being said ... did anyone else get the impression that Ariel used she Shadows for his own sadistic purposes.
Oh Ariel - you twisted person you! Personally I think he is a much better baddie than Voldemort *cough* but I digress :P
I would still like to figure out WHY he's so twisted. I guess it comes back to the question "Is someone born evil, or do they become so?"
Perhaps Alexi (who, btw I checked was announced Dead at the start of book 2, hehe I had the same Alexi =Salamander idea as well) had done something to his son that made him so twisted. The Zebrakhn comes to mind... I am about to start reading Book1-4 again (or at least book 1 :P) so yes. I also recall that Ariel wasn't too fond of Alexi.
Though I wonder how much can be revealed now from her earlier novels...
The Laptop and other mentions of Beforetime Tech - At first, I thought this was a little weird, especially the confirmation the keys are more like passwords than tangible objects, but then it struck me that all of this really helped to enforce that Elspeth's world is based in a time after our own.
Other than that... so many little editing issues - gah oh wells.
Brilliant book - my favourite by far. There isn't a bit in the story that doesn't leave you on the edge of your seat.
Finally:
I'm sorry DameonxElspeth fans - but Yay for Rushton and Elspeth!! I don't understand why so many people can hate him so much???
Personally, I loved seeing Rushton reject Elspeth in this book because it seemed to me that Elspeth FINALLY realised her feelings for Rushton.
Poor Dameon though - I wonder what shall ever become of him?
16 years ago
Thu Jan 31 2008, 10:40am
OKay so after owning the book for 32 hours, I finished it last night at 12:43am, and was annoyed that I couldn't log onto my computer without waking the household and type up all my theories. And now after reading all the spoilers ;), I have some...
FINISHED!!! *huzzah*
"Lets start at the very beginign, a very good place to start" (something there for you sound of music fans)
So, my first hour and a half of reading was on the bus back home from Min's. Aside from some loud teenagers and a window shattering but still remaining in the sill, my mind was focused entirely on the book.
Okay so I started typing away, but it got a little confusing...so please bare with me :)
The re-introduction of Darga and other past events between Elspeth and Zarak were good reminders, but for me reinforced some ideas that I had had before. However, the blockade and all that happened in Saithwold had me gasping outloud. How could she just keep going down the tunnel! Argh, woman, use some common sense...but i suppose that's why we all (well majority) like Elspeth, cause she does the things she does and it seems to mostly all work out.
I loved all the Norsesailors too, specially Lark, he was such a sweetie, and doesn't sound to bad on the eyes...in our imaginations...yeah
Herder Cloister: I found this very very interesting, but at the same time, all the events so hectic and close together got me a little confused as i hurried to find out about the torture rescue i knew would come, or if Ariel was in the cloister! Lud, the suspense! However, a great insight as to the runnings of the Herder Faction, the shadows, the Norseland people, it was great background again into what else was happening on the land. I especially liked (not in a weird way) how the shadows were so ruthless, in doing what they only knew to do. Probs not making sense atm, but I mean the scene where the two girl shadows tired to kill the One, and Elspeth makes a comment about how the way that they were forced to live backfired on their 'master'. Although this sorta contridicted the love that Cindra had for the novice...who's name i cannot remember atm, it had an E in it.
But all the discussion about the One and the Threes etc was most insightful, and I like it. Cleared up so much stuff from the other books...I always knew those priests were dodgey :)
How chance though that Maruman's name calls a dolphin to you!!! I am sooooooooo trying it next time I go to the beach...or even Sea World! I so want to ride on a dolphin even more now ! :)
OKay so i think i shall do as others and just talk about ppl now...
Elspeth: I loved her in this book, she wasn't as distant from everyone, she just did what she had to do. When Rushton told her that he didn't love her anymore, I cried! But then I remembered that someone had said that Rushton supporters would love this book, so i was hopeful for some sort of cure happening. I was worried about her though, I mean, she left Maruman and Gahlta...what was she thinking he, he. I agree with Maruman's anger...
Domick: OMG!! When I saw his name at the end of the chapter I was soooooooooooo hopeful! I was sure that Elspeth was going to save him before he was contagious, take him somewhere where she would care for him, herself not getting sick cause of her healing ability and then he would be able to tell everyone about Ariel and how to stop him...Called that one wrong though didn't i :) (sad smile) But I did enjoy (is that the wrong word to use?) the split personalities that IC used, it was very well done. Poor Domick! And the description of him shaking and the buboes, it made me tear up.
And Domick's speech about what he loves, Mika hates, and it pointed out how much he loved Rushton and Kella :( And when Rushton was looking at him, ;( And then it was all over...Elspeth talking about Obernewtyn as he slowly went...was lovely. And then everyone's memories at his funeral...him and kella...more tears
Rushton: The scene of him trying to attack Elspeth brough to mind the scene of very similar happenings from 'I am Legend' (those who have seen it know what I'm talking about), But Elspeth was beautiful in her taking him in her arms, not giving up on him. And his subconcious! loved the bears! Ariel was still freaky though!
and then he was himself again, happy and loving elf! I love the bits of happiness and togetherness that they have. But i am always sad that it is so short lived!
but what about the price to be paid!!!!!???!?!?!?!?!
At first thought came that he would die eventually anyways. But after a couple of seconds I thought maybe that Atthis would pay more, because it said that Elf used some golden energy stuff to rescue Rushton, that must have put a drain on poor Atthis
But I am in agreement over Rushton=Cassy's blood. It makes sense...what others have said and all that :) Although until I read the last 50 pages, I was still convinced that it was Swallow. I was disappointed to not have him in this book :(. but you can't have everything.
Salamander: as soon as they found clothes in 'salamader's room' at Ariel's i immediately thought he/she/it was a woman! THe yellow eyes made me also think of Jakoby, so salamader equalled a sadorian to me from that moment on. However, then there was the man getting stiched up...so i agree that maybe there are many people who are salamander. Because i always thought that he was the Red Queen's evil second in command dude...the one that killed her. But it may make sense that they all take turns...maybe one of them goes to certain places...or something.
Also, in a dream, i think it was...or was it the laptop writings..but Cassy said something ...yup lap top :" how strange to speak of time, when i have defied it more that once and in more that one way in my life"
that screams of time travel to me! over the dream trails. I also thought that the little girl on the dreamtrails with young Maruman or should i say Merimyn :), is actually a young Cassy, hence she refered to him as Merimyn on the laptop.
Okay so i just previewed how long this post is, and I am now going to be sucinct as i can..
little girl cassy's loved as daughter=hannah's child.
dameon: very sweet, clearly in love with elf, not gonna happen
matthew: i recon is destroyer now, but he will be tricked by ariel, nothing done in choice.
Daffyd: I always thought he was the destroyer, cause he always just poped up, sometimes so randomly it seemed pointless...but eh, matthew, poor boy.
Gilbert: loved having him back. he could have been good for elf, if rushton was not so awesome
Dragon: where'd she go? there was so little of her, but i suppose she did take up ashling and the keeping place ;)
so much more to say...
to be continued....
I'm SOOOO close but I, like Clare, am missing pages! It made no sense, my book went back to page 857 from 904, then back to 904 and then from 953 to the end. Cruel cruel fate! I was reading it this morning!
Anyway, I haven't read most of the spoilers above because I've still got 100 pages to go, so you might've already said this.
Page 904
I noticed this book seemed to have a lot of little errors. Like when the third boat is missing (which it still is for me so don't tell me if they find it!) at Norseland, they mention Brydda's on, then they talk to him, and then they talk about how he's missing on the boat again. And right when my book cut out Rushton had just stopped bashing himself on walls and had opened the box thing, and somehow Elspeth entered his mind even though she'd just talked about him wearing a demon band. There were lots of them, those are only the most recent ones I remember.
Still page 904, but this time I'm not discussing errors
That said, I'm definitely loving this book! I was so annoyed when I realised I didn't have the pages, it's right in the middle of a really good bit! Elspeth still annoys me sometimes, my Lud she's so ... anti help. But still, it's a great book!
*sniff* Domick!! At least the last scenes with him were good, and he triumphed over Mika.
I'm so glad I reread Ashling and TKP before this. Can't believe my book had to cut out mid-sentence of a dream! At the end of a chapter would've been okay, but this is almost nailbiting!
Ashling Guildmistress
16 years ago
Ashling Guildmistress
Mage
When I read the last line of the book last night - a little shiver ran through me. It was so - thrilling! I cannot wait till The Sneding!
What I love about this series is that IC never fails to surprise us. Unlike Harry Potter nothing revealed was a MAJOR surprise. Granted - the two books are aimed at different audiences and are about different things - but I merely point out the fact the differences in speculating and their results in the book.
Then again - we have been speculating 'The Sneding' and not so much 'The Stone Key' Still - the way IC writes and leaves so much open for speculation (and bits not put in to leave us pondering what the heck such and such character could have to do with anything - is great!
I was pondering today, that despite my earlier comment about Ariel ending up with no one - do you think perhaps Salamander (if she is indeed Selesh) and Ariel have a thing?
I could see major attraction on her side - she loves pretty things and we are constantly reminded again and again that Ariel is stunning handsome (what a waste!). And even though I have issues with Ariel being attracted to someone who is deformed - she is only deformed physically and perhaps her cruelness and mind attracts him...
Another thing that struck me was Mika's speil to Elspeth.
"... He said that you would ask who my master was and I was to say it was Ariel" pg. 672/673
If Ariel wanted Mika to tell Elspeth it was him, why didn't Mika just say something like "He said that you would ask who my master, Ariel is clever like that"
:-/ or at least something like - even that wording doesn't strike me as correct but anyways:
So I thought perhaps Mika's master is different from Ariel - that maybe the 'brains' behind the outfit is Salamander - but Salamander is a girl? Well, perhaps Mika did not know this.
...
Yes there are a lot of ifs in that theory but hey :P It's a theory none-the-less
Only been reading today cos it turned up around 1pm
pg 186-188
*sniffles* i was teary, i know she has to live but i have no idea what he was going to do with her, poor Elspeth.....
Mystic Guilden
16 years ago
Mystic Guilden
Mage
No theory here, just a question i need cleared up...if anyone can :D
The brooch or pin Elspeth picked up in Ariels house / the womans room...it was (if i recall properly, dont have my book within reach atm) a cat with one yellow eye right?
I thought a brooch ot pin of a similar description was mentioned in one of the earlier books? Was it something Elf purchased at a Moonfair at Ober??
I was just curious because the pin struck me as important at the time. Maybe it was just because I found the whole "womans things in Ariel's house" a little unexpected :P
Ashling Guildmistress
16 years ago
Thu Jan 31 2008, 05:47pm
Ashling Guildmistress
Mage
I immediately thought Maruman - and it struck me as something of importance as well. Notice that Elspeth didn't get a chance to show Jakoby... so coming up again!
Ah, it makes me wonder - if Salamander is Selesh - and she worked at the Earthtemple - how much does she know of Elspeth's quest and if so, has she mentioned it to Ariel?
Ari, I think she bought a cloak pin from Enoch in TKP that was a one eyed cat...
Other things that I didn't mention before:
The shadows! They creeped me out, man. And so did Elkar, the novice. It was so creepy how the didn't see that murder was bad! And the girls who tried to kill the One... *shivers*
Oh, and where Cassy says that she has defied time twice! I reckon once to get from the beforetime to after the age of chaos, and twice to bring Merimyn/Maruman to Elspeth from the past.
Analivia. What is up with her? Sounds like she's a misfit... She was a bit strange :/
Right, that's all I can think of right now...
Ashling Guildmistress
16 years ago
Ashling Guildmistress
Mage
Lalala more space filler
*giggles at the thought of Ariel in a dress*
I feel a fanpiccy coming on... :P